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No WRs on night 1, but some eye-popping times nonetheless:
-Phelps 48.4 leading off the relay
-Magnini 47.1 anchoring for Italy
-Steffen 52.6 anchoring for the German women and Henry 53.4 leading off for the Australian women – these 2 will have a great race in the individual 100
-Manadou going 4:02 again
-Tae Hwan Park winning his first world championship – I don’t see anybody beating this guy in the 400 for a while, but can he break 3:40? -
Park has a long way to go to break 3:40…Not saying he has no chance, but 4+ seconds in a 400 isn’t a piece of cake! I think he takes silver or bronze next year (behind Hackett and possibly Keller).
Another swim of note – Jason Lezak with a 47.32 split – I’m thinking that is the fastest American split ever. People have been all down on Lezak because he is old… dude is fast, and getting faster still.
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Yeah, I should have specified “in his career” for the Park question. I certainly don’t think he’ll do so in Beijing, and probably not ever (I think that might be the strongest record on the books right now), although he has more potential than anybody else on the horizon. As for Hackett and Keller, you have to keep in mind that A) they’re not getting any younger and Keller swam lousy yesterday morning, and B) Hackett will be most focused on the 1500 whereas Park’s best race is probably the 400. I think Park wins this in Beijing, but it should be a terrific race.
Lezak is the consumate anchor, always exceeding expectations. However I think he is no match for Magnini this week, and Jones may beat him in the Trials next summer.
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Pleasant surprise of the day: It seems that Fox Sports Net is showing the meet every day at 4:00. I didn’t realize this until today or I would have taped the first two shows. Needless to say I will be taping the remainder of the meet and avoiding swiminfo.com like the plague in order to be surprised when I watch it after work.
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This has got to be the best night of swimming at the international level since the first night of the Sydney Olympics (5 WRs in 4 finals back then). I did not expect Phelps to break that record until after Beijing, when he’s supposed to retire from the 4 IM. He said lifting weights seriously for the first time has helped a lot. Memo to the rest of the world’s elite 200 and 100 swimmers: Be afraid, be very afraid.
It was also great to see Natalie C. finally re-break her WR after 5 years of coming close so many times, and to see Peirsol fend off his rivals (look out in that 2 back). Awesome performance all around by the US!
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Laura Manaudou’s schedule has been the most impressive thing at this meet so far. To tackle the 100 Back, 1500 Free and 200 Free in the same night is incredible at any level, even more so at the World level. To come away with the times she did is kind of mind boggling. Yes, she got 8th in the 1500 but she took it out for at least 500 with Zeigler after just minutes before becoming the second female ever to go under 1:00 in the 100 back. She then followed that up with a very good 200 free. In Beijing she has a shot at 5 or 6 medals which I think will be as impressive as if Phelps can win 7 golds since she will not likely get any relay medals with the way the Australian, German and American women are swimming right now.
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@swimbadger wrote:
Laura Manaudou’s schedule has been the most impressive thing at this meet so far. To tackle the 100 Back, 1500 Free and 200 Free in the same night is incredible at any level, even more so at the World level. To come away with the times she did is kind of mind boggling. Yes, she got 8th in the 1500 but she took it out for at least 500 with Zeigler after just minutes before becoming the second female ever to go under 1:00 in the 100 back. She then followed that up with a very good 200 free. In Beijing she has a shot at 5 or 6 medals which I think will be as impressive as if Phelps can win 7 golds since she will not likely get any relay medals with the way the Australian, German and American women are swimming right now.
And she just broke the 200 WR be a second!
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@The Treat wrote:
obviously the WR’s set were pretty ridiculous, but i think it deserves mentioning that neil walker, yes, 64 year old neil walker is still competing. he was on the 400 FR on day 1 and went a 48.3 (i think). thats pretty damn impressive to still be that fast.
Neil Walker is a week or so younger than me. Thanks.
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Speaking of Older swimmers or retired swimmer at least. I have a friend who was swimming at the New England Masters meet and Anhtony Irving (25 is not old, but he was retired) was there swimming. I guess his teammates said he has been training for a shot at the 2008 Olympics. He won the 100 free in a very relaxed 47.30 and then anchored a relay in what I heard looked like a relaxed 44 low. His 50 free was a 19.7.
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@swim5599 wrote:
Phelps 200 fly 1:52.0 are you kidding me.
I think the Spitz vs. Phelps debate is over. As far as I’m concerned, he’s the greatest ever if he retired right now. 18 WRs (potentially 21 by Saturday), 2nd to Spitz’s 26. 1st man to set WRs in 3 disciplines. 2nd and 10th all time in his “off” events (2 Bk & 1 Fr). We are seeing the most incredible swimmer ever right now.
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@Its all an ACT wrote:
Speaking of Older swimmers or retired swimmer at least. I have a friend who was swimming at the New England Masters meet and Anhtony Irving (25 is not old, but he was retired) was there swimming. I guess his teammates said he has been training for a shot at the 2008 Olympics. He won the 100 free in a very relaxed 47.30 and then anchored a relay in what I heard looked like a relaxed 44 low. His 50 free was a 19.7.
It’s Ervin. The only Irving I can think of is John Irving, the writer.
Anthony posts on Gary Hall Jr’s website, theraceclub.net. A while back he posted that he did a set of 20 50’s kick SCM on 55 seconds. I thought, hmm I could do that. He’ll win the 50 at the Olympic trials, IMO.
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@Chris Knight wrote:
I think the Spitz vs. Phelps debate is over. As far as I’m concerned, he’s the greatest ever if he retired right now. 18 WRs (potentially 21 by Saturday), 2nd to Spitz’s 26. 1st man to set WRs in 3 disciplines. 2nd and 10th all time in his “off” events (2 Bk & 1 Fr). We are seeing the most incredible swimmer ever right now.
I agree. Until this meet I would have admitted that there was still some debate. The 2 free record changed that for me and the 2 fly is just an added bonus, although an impressive one.
It’s great that Ervin is back. I miss both of those guys.
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He said in a USA Today interview about a month ago that he would probably not swim anything longer than 200 after Beijing. I agree that he has the potential to give that record a good shot, but I don’t think he’ll ever swim it again as anything more than a training event. But I think he’ll break the WR in the 1 free by the time he retires.
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@Chris Knight wrote:
He said in a USA Today interview about a month ago that he would probably not swim anything longer than 200 after Beijing. I agree that he has the potential to give that record a good shot, but I don’t think he’ll ever swim it again as anything more than a training event. But I think he’ll break the WR in the 1 free by the time he retires.
yeah, saw that as well. seems he’ll be focusing on sprints.
im speechless at the 1:52.0. ridiculous.
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Phelps will not break Hoogie’s 100 free record anytime soon, if ever. 48.4 is a LOT LOT LOT different from 47.8. You have to realize that he was really jacked up to lead off that relay because he had to prove to everyone that it was a good decision to put him on it (see 2004 olympics). He has had a FILTHY, and I mean FILTHY meet so far. Do you really think that he can drop another .6 seconds (which is A LOT OF TIME IN 100 meters)?
On another note, as much as I want Lochte to win the 200IM, Phelps will annhilate that field. Judging from his other swims, he will go 154 high, and yes, 1 second in a 200 is a lot different from .6 in a 100. -
@screeeeeeeeech wrote:
Phelps will not break Hoogie’s 100 free record anytime soon, if ever. 48.4 is a LOT LOT LOT different from 47.8. You have to realize that he was really jacked up to lead off that relay because he had to prove to everyone that it was a good decision to put him on it (see 2004 olympics). He has had a FILTHY, and I mean FILTHY meet so far. Do you really think that he can drop another .6 seconds (which is A LOT OF TIME IN 100 meters)?
On another note, as much as I want Lochte to win the 200IM, Phelps will annhilate that field. Judging from his other swims, he will go 154 high, and yes, 1 second in a 200 is a lot different from .6 in a 100.Uh… Yeah, I think he can drop 6 tenths in the 100 free when he switches from training for the 200 fly and 200/400 IM combo to training for sprint freestyle…. why don’t you?
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@screeeeeeeeech wrote:
Do you really think that he can drop another .6 seconds (which is A LOT OF TIME IN 100 meters)?
In 5 years? Considering he only just started lifting this past year and dropped .4 between Pan Pacs and this week? Absolutely.
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I mentioned this on the other sight but now that Lochte owns the fastest times in history scy in the 100 and 200 back, scm in the 100 and 200 back, and lcm in the 200 back can we finally say he is the best backstroker in the world right now. Yes Peirsol has the gold medals, but that will change in a year.
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@swim5599 wrote:
can we finally say he is the best backstroker in the world right now.
No. The last 6 times that they raced in a major competition, Lochte has won once. We can say that Lochte has a chance to dethrone Piersol next year.
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@swim5599 wrote:
I mentioned this on the other sight but now that Lochte owns the fastest times in history scy in the 100 and 200 back, scm in the 100 and 200 back, and lcm in the 200 back can we finally say he is the best backstroker in the world right now. Yes Peirsol has the gold medals, but that will change in a year.
Yeah seriously! Piersol has lost once in 6 years HE SUCKS!!!
Lochte Homer.
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i would almost say that it was more of piersol losing it than lochte winning it.. aaron died on the last 50.. he went a 30.44.. but in the semi’s where it was evident that he coasted in the last 50 he went a 29.95.. not sure what happened that last 50 in the finals
not to take anything away from lochte tho.. that was a great swim
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In reference to Lochte vs Peirsol: Lochte has the WR, he is the better 200m backstroker. LOCHTE, not Peirsol, won when it counted. Until the next big race, Lochte is the man to beat in that event as he is the WORLD CHAMPION.
RE the 50, I thought it was awesome that BWT had such a breakthrough performance. Winning out of lane 7 must’ve shocked a lot of people. Also, what happened to Schoeman? According to him, he was going to blow up at this meet. -
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@Chris Knight wrote:
I have always understood yards better than meters, so I converted Phelps’ times on swiminfo. Of course no conversion is perfect, but these are really mind blowing.
1 fr: 41.79
2 fr: 1:29.84
2 fl: 1:37.07
2 IM: 1:38.54
1 fl: 44.07
4 IM: 3:32.98The crazy thing is… I think those are right. MAybe not exactly for Phelps, but I think those are equivalent to what one would be going in comparison to everyone else in the world to be equally as dominent (if everyone in the world also did SCY). If you get what I mean. Just sick. SICK.
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@swim5599 wrote:
so the age old question of what makes you best comes up then. Is it head to head wins and gold medals or World Records?
To me, if you set a world record in which you beat the previous world record holder in a race, that answers the question of who is the better 200 backstroker. I don’t care if Peirsol had a bad turn and screwed up his last 50, or whatever. Lochte has the fastest time ever. This is why swimming and other timed sports are great.
Obviously it could go back and forth. If in ten years when they both retire (wishful thinking perhaps) Peirsol has the world record by 0.01 he should be considered the greatest relative to his time.
When you peruse college swimming websites, do you look for things like “national qualifier” or “state champion in high school”? No, you immediately find their fastest times. This gives you the quickest and most dependable reference to their caliber.
So, if a swimmer wins every gold medal in an event and his/her WR time is bettered by someone of the same age who has never swam internationally, and sets the record at a random-ass meet, the second person should be considered the greatest of their time.
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I disagree, when will she swim a rested 1500 before Beijing? This summer, maybe, but that meet will be a low priority for all Olympic hopefuls. If it was an Olympic event I’d pick her to break it at the Trials, but since it’s not I suspect it will not fall until 09 Worlds.
The 800, however, should be broken by both Ziegler and Manadou in Beijing.
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Notice when I was talking about Lochte I did not say the best ever I said is he the best current backstroker in the world. If we go based on History then yes Peirsol is the greatest backstroker, but if we are going to go right now I would say that Lochte has a legit argument.
Under 1:30 in the 200 free that just seems like a typo unreal
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@CaseBrst10 wrote:
Is perisol better overall than krayzelburg? He dominated the ncaa at USC, and worlds.
Krayzelburg was the first man to hold the world record in both backstrokes since I don’t know when (anyone want to look it up). Krayzelburg only won one title in the backstroke at NCAA’s. It was the 200 backstroke, the year Neil Walker broke his hand finishing the 400 medlay relay as the first man under 45 in the backstroke.
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@swim5599 wrote:
Notice when I was talking about Lochte I did not say the best ever I said is he the best current backstroker in the world. If we go based on History then yes Peirsol is the greatest backstroker, but if we are going to go right now I would say that Lochte has a legit argument.
Under 1:30 in the 200 free that just seems like a typo unreal
I do agree – you can make a legit case for Lochte. Personally, I won’t put Lochte ahead of Piersol until he beats him at the olympics next year.
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@swim5599 wrote:
Rhyme it is not in our nature to agree on things on this forum, I guess I finally wore you down with all the Lochte talk HAHA. Congrats on the engagement.
hehe – no offense meant : ) I’d say we agree at least *half* the time anyway, and that is only including the devisive subjects of forums. Not like everyday things like… if we like sandwiches or not. I like a good sandwich, I mean good as in good fresh bread for starters. But I digress…
It just wouldn’t be fun if everyone thought Lochte was the best backstroker in the world now, would it? : )
Oh – and thanks about the engagement. I’m psyched about getting married to Emily (Malone)!
Dude – speaking of personal/athletic things – I’m 5 out of 6 in races since last fall (2/3 running races (one second place) and 3/3 in triathlons), I started doing triathlons last April. All local races between 50 and 700 people : ) I just got my elite/pro license and will be doing a few pro races this summer. Running is my strongest event, swimming and cycling are about even. : P
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Dude – speaking of personal/athletic things – I’m 5 out of 6 in races since last fall (2/3 running races (one second place) and 3/3 in triathlons), I started doing triathlons last April. All local races between 50 and 700 people : ) I just got my elite/pro license and will be doing a few pro races this summer. Running is my strongest event, swimming and cycling are about even. : P
You’ve gotta start racing bikes. It’s a great sport, lots of fun and not just do you get to suffer, but you get to make other people suffer too…that and with a little teamwork and racing smarts, you can beat people who are faster than you…something that’s pretty tough to do in running/tri/swimming…
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Or you can make the decision I made (I have no running speed and I am not all that good on the bike) and start running marathons. I was pretty excited to beat people like Tim DeBoom and get top 5 on the swim leg of 1/2 Ironmans, but then I’d get something like bottom 1/2 on the bike leg.
The first couple of marathons, you’ll lose your toenails, and you may not be able to walk upstairs or down for a few days, but after that, it gets pretty good.
I’m running the Boston Marathon on April 16th. I was pretty excited to qualify: it was the first “cut” I made since December of 1993. This marathon will be my 8th in total, and I might be crazy enough to run the Cincinnati Flying Pig marathon three weeks later.
In terms of racing marathons, it’s me 1, Brad Shively 0 in head-to-head competition!
I’m thinking about Ultramarathons. Those are the races for the slow and the very stubborn.
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@RhymeAndReason wrote:
@swim5599 wrote:
I just got my elite/pro license and will be doing a few pro races this summer.
I am curious on how you get the license? Do you get your membership card or whatever for Tri and then earn points like in cycling?
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@maverick wrote:
rhyme, which pro races are you planning on doing this year?
any thoughts of doing ITU pro racing?
Hey Mav – I acually tried to e-mail you about this last fall – did you get that? I’m planning on focusing on ITU actually, as running is my fastest and least developed event and I have the swimming background. I’m planning on being at Mussleman ITU in July. I was figuring we’d get to race there 🙂 I’ll probably do Philly tri in June, and then we’ll see later in the year, I’m going to be Europe in August so that’ll screw training up a bit.
@Its all an ACT wrote:
I am curious on how you get the license? Do you get your membership card or whatever for Tri and then earn points like in cycling?
It is actually pretty easy to get, the question is are you really good enough to compete in pro fields. I think I am, we’ll see : ) You have to finish top 8 in three sactioned triathlons with more than 500 starters in 12 months.
@Southwestern U. Swimming wrote:
You’ve gotta start racing bikes. It’s a great sport, lots of fun and not just do you get to suffer, but you get to make other people suffer too…that and with a little teamwork and racing smarts, you can beat people who are faster than you…something that’s pretty tough to do in running/tri/swimming…
Yeah, I donno… I know everyone says that the bike is the least talent dependant of the three sports, but right now it probably is the worst of my legs, I just can’t see doing it full time : ) Now running, I possibly could get into that. I’ve only really been running for about 10 months now, I don’t know how much talent I actually have for it yet – I know that I’m a whole lot better runner than I ever was a swimmer though!
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@PioneerSwimming wrote:
Or you can make the decision I made (I have no running speed and I am not all that good on the bike) and start running marathons. I was pretty excited to beat people like Tim DeBoom and get top 5 on the swim leg of 1/2 Ironmans, but then I’d get something like bottom 1/2 on the bike leg.
The first couple of marathons, you’ll lose your toenails, and you may not be able to walk upstairs or down for a few days, but after that, it gets pretty good.
I’m running the Boston Marathon on April 16th. I was pretty excited to qualify: it was the first “cut” I made since December of 1993. This marathon will be my 8th in total, and I might be crazy enough to run the Cincinnati Flying Pig marathon three weeks later.
In terms of racing marathons, it’s me 1, Brad Shively 0 in head-to-head competition!
I’m thinking about Ultramarathons. Those are the races for the slow and the very stubborn.
Dude – good luck next monday! There are four people on my triathlon team who are running as well – one you should look out for – Kristen Price. She ran a 1:13 half at nats earlier this year. This is her first serious marathon attempt, she ran a 2:44 last fall without really training for it. Not to say that she doesn’t have a running background – she was the 2002 NCAA Div I 10k champ… I’m the only male on our tri team that can (sometimes and only over 10k and less) outrun her! : p
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@Cookie Monster wrote:
Anyone notice Kate Ziegler’s 15:53? Within a second of Janet Evans’ supposedly unbreakable record. I think we’ll see that one fall before Beijing. Simply incredible.
@Chris Knight wrote:
I disagree, when will she swim a rested 1500 before Beijing? This summer, maybe, but that meet will be a low priority for all Olympic hopefuls. If it was an Olympic event I’d pick her to break it at the Trials, but since it’s not I suspect it will not fall until 09 Worlds.
Well, I’m an idiot: http://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/lane9/news/14962.asp
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@Chris Knight wrote:
@Cookie Monster wrote:
Anyone notice Kate Ziegler’s 15:53? Within a second of Janet Evans’ supposedly unbreakable record. I think we’ll see that one fall before Beijing. Simply incredible.
@Chris Knight wrote:
I disagree, when will she swim a rested 1500 before Beijing? This summer, maybe, but that meet will be a low priority for all Olympic hopefuls. If it was an Olympic event I’d pick her to break it at the Trials, but since it’s not I suspect it will not fall until 09 Worlds.
Well, I’m an idiot: http://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/lane9/news/14962.asp
Don’t feel to bad. That is AMAZING. I’d rather be out here armchairing than in pool with her, that is forsure!
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