Paul Yemm Coaching at Millikin?

Forums Conferences College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin Paul Yemm Coaching at Millikin?

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    • #12120

      Anybody know what happened to the Millikin? Heard he resigned suddenly.

    • #32522
      Psimon3
      Member

      Paul Kuetermann resigned for personal reasons.

    • #32523
      swim5599
      Member

      Is Yemm really coaching there? If that is true that is great.

    • #32524
      Psimon3
      Member

      Yemm and Kara Bryant (and few other recent grads) are serving as interim coaches for the remainder of the season. The university is planning a search with the hope of having a coach in place after NCAA’s

    • #32525
      jj
      Member

      @Psimon3 wrote:

      Paul Kuetermann resigned for personal reasons.

      That wasn’t really the story that I heard.

    • #32526
      Psimon3
      Member

      @jj wrote:

      That wasn’t really the story that I heard.

      I know what happend as I am very close to both Paul and Millikin University athletics and any and specualtion about this situation needs to be addressed by either the athletics department or Paul.

      end of line…

    • #32527
      jj
      Member

      @Psimon3 wrote:

      @jj wrote:

      That wasn’t really the story that I heard.

      I know what happend as I am very close to both Paul and Millikin University athletics and any and specualtion about this situation needs to be addressed by either the athletics department or Paul.

      end of line…

      I know, my story came from the Milikin AD thats why I said I did’t think that was how it went down. I don’t think it would be right to say exactly what happened, coming from me, but I don’t think it is right to say he resigned either. Just my opinion,

    • #32528
      swim5599
      Member

      That is too bad that he left, he seemed like he was doing a pretty decent job there.

    • #32529
      swimvolt77
      Member

      “I know, my story came from the Milikin AD thats why I said I did’t think that was how it went down. I don’t think it would be right to say exactly what happened, coming from me, but I don’t think it is right to say he resigned either. Just my opinion,” -JJ

      I think it’s pretty sad that some people choose to use public message board forums to slander a coach…and possibly hurt their career and character….

    • #32530
      The15mMark
      Member

      @swimvolt77 wrote:

      “I know, my story came from the Milikin AD thats why I said I did’t think that was how it went down. I don’t think it would be right to say exactly what happened, coming from me, but I don’t think it is right to say he resigned either. Just my opinion,” -JJ

      I think it’s pretty sad that some people choose to use public message board forums to slander a coach…and possibly hurt their career and character….

      Agreed. If he resigned, he resigned. Leave it at that. The beauty of D3 athletics is that we don’t have to deal with all the scandal and controversy seen everyday in D1 and professional level athletics. Leave the man to his business and focus on what’s really important: the awesomeness hat is D3swmming.com

    • #32531
      jj
      Member

      That was pretty much my point…

    • #32532
      babwik
      Member

      As far as rumor goes, this has been very tame by message board standards. No one wrote anything slanderous about any circumstances leading to the parting of ways, only questions as to who initiated it. Look at Minnesota’s B-ball coach, does anyone think it was his choice to resign? Any mid-season coaching change raises eyebrows and draws attention, especially when those in the know are so aggressive about NOT talking about it

      Doesn’t matter though, what’s done is done. I feel bad for the kids going through the season with a coach by committee of recent grads. That’s tough. On the plus side, they have always had a good program and are now ahead of the pack to get the best of this next year’s coaching crop! I imagine recruiting this year will be tough though.

    • #32533
      swimvolt77
      Member

      “That was pretty much my point…” -JJ

      If that was your point then you did a pretty terrible job of trying to convey that.

      “my story came from the Milikin AD thats why I said I did’t think that was how it went down” -JJ

      You are leading people to speculate things and there is a lot of gray area in that statement.

      “I don’t think it would be right to say exactly what happened, coming from me…” -JJ

      Then don’t say anything that at all! You are stating here that you don’t have a first hand account of the situation.

      “but I don’t think it is right to say he resigned either” -JJ

      You are leaving a pretty large door open for speculation by people in that statement and talking out of two sides of your mouth.

      A word of advice to JJ, you might rethink the ethics of what you are doing before you put it in writing

      Also, I highly doubt that the AD at Millikin would disclose information to a third party, outside of the university about the status of someone’s employment. I don’t know what the practices and policies of that university are, but I know a lot of legal issues are raised with dealing in that situation of discussing someone’s employment in the private sector and at the university level. Try the truth next time….it makes things a lot easier

      In Closing…

      I am sick and tired of seeing things of this nature being posted on collegeswimming and d3swimming that only end up hurting people and also hurting the sport of swimming….I thought the purpose of these sites was to promote our sport and to get people excited about what college swimming is all about…Our sport is falling apart with actions from parent boards in club swimming and with more kids choosing soccer….and of course with low funding from universities and Title 9 wiping programs off the map. The sport is struggling enough at the college level without our own people hurting it. If you want to degrade, slander, and speculate on matters that you really don’t have any facts or first hand knowledge about and just want to state your opinion freely, go to a pro sports message board where damaging statements won’t hurt a multi-million dollar franchise or go hang out with Michael Moore where you will fit in a lot better. But do us all a favor: stay away from these forums and get out of the sport of swimming because we have no place for you. You are only hurting the sport and turning against the direction that this sport needs to move in.

      The15mMark hit it on the head exactly when he stated:
      “The beauty of D3 athletics is that we don’t have to deal with all the scandal and controversy seen everyday in D1 and professional level athletics. Leave the man to his business and focus on what’s really important: the awesomeness hat is D3swmming.com”

      Those of us who have been fighting the battles over the years to help our sport and keep it alive and viewed in a positive light would probably all agree that you need to rethink what you are doing to the swimming community as a whole when you place statements like this in writing, on a public message board, on the Internet, for everyone to see. I hope that swimming can stay out of the scandal and controversy and move ahead in the right direction. I just wish the people who are choosing to be apart of the sport understand the seriousness of what swimming is facing.

      Thank you.

    • #32534

      Swimvolt –

      Okay, see, the problem with all this writing and super defensiveness/agressiveness you show is that before, no one outside of the situation really cared either way. Now A: We (I) think you are really annoying and kind of mean, writing in all bold big fonts to lecture people anonymously (although I do mostly agree with you), and B: while before I really had no idea, and certainly wasn’t thinking either way about this coach leaving, now in my mind I think something *must* have gone down, since someone like you, who has never posted before, is so vehemently telling poeple that it isn’t their business – in a tiny little segment of a forum that I think 10 people regularly read. Nice work.

    • #32535
      swimvolt77
      Member

      You have missed the entire point of what I was saying.

      I have no idea what went on with this situation nor do I care to know…I am just sick of seeing this time and time again on these forums involving peoples careers and jobs

      I post on collegeswimming.com a lot and just read this forum rather than participate in it, but I guess this just hit a nerve with me due to the fact that I get sick of the “rumors” and “speculations” that are on here on subjects that are really none of our business.

      It’s not just about message boards and forums…it’s about the actions that people are choosing in general that hurt the sport outside of the pool when they should really be looking at what can be done to move things in a positive direction rather than bringing others down and hurting programs. The actions that I have seen outside of the pool (and this is just one example of what I am talking about) that continue to divide and not unite.

      I just feel that if you are going to freely put up posts about situations like this and try explain what went on and say that you have heard or talked to sources then you should have to put your name on it. If you have to put your name on things like that then I think more people would stop and think before they type or not post it all. It would make people more accountable for rumor and speculation posts dealing with situations of this manner.

      The game of telephone never works.

      Thanks.

    • #32536

      @swimvolt77 wrote:

      You have missed the entire point of what I was saying.

      I have no idea what went on with this situation nor do I care to know…I am just sick of seeing this time and time again on these forums involving peoples careers and jobs

      I post on collegeswimming.com a lot and just read this forum rather than participate in it, but I guess this just hit a nerve with me due to the fact that I get sick of the “rumors” and “speculations” that are on here on subjects that are really none of our business.

      I just feel that if you are going to freely put up posts about situations like this and try explain what went on and say that you have heard or talked to sources then you should have to put your name on it. If you have to put your name on things like that then I think more people would stop and think before they type or not post it all. It would make people more accountable for rumor and speculation posts dealing with situations of this manner.

      The game of telephone never works.

      Thanks.

      Fair enough, I agree. Thanks for clarifying that you aren’t involved in any way. I try to stay away from controversal things in forums now because it has gotten me in trouble twice – once wasn’t really a big deal at all, some people don’t handle honest opinions of their team’s ability (and correct, if I do say so myself =), one time I was out of line.

      I do remember seeing your screen name on collegeswimming.com.

    • #32537
      swimvolt77
      Member

      Thanks for understanding where I was coming from on this. I appreciate your honesty and your support of the sport that we all love. I think we have all said things in our lives that we regret and wish we could take back. I only hope that we all can learn from them and help others as well.

      Let’s keep college swimming moving forward!

      Thanks.

    • #32538
      jj
      Member

      Swim, thank you for the advice and the very detailed breakdown of my four lines of text. Maybe I did do a terrible job of conveying my opinion, I’m really not sure? I just don’t think that I was implying the things that you are saying/accusing me of.

      My intent was to keep my comments brief apparently I kept them too brief and allowed them to be taken out of the context that I had intended.

      Mr. Obvious told me not that long ago that I am prone to getting sucked into these boards and yet again that is correct.

      Justin Jennings

    • #32539
      aquaholic
      Member

      Those of us who have been fighting the battles over the years to help our sport and keep it alive and viewed in a positive light

      yeah, ok, but there are people who are hurting our sport. imagine a coach gets fired for sleeping with one of his swimmers. could be this case, could be another, THAT person is hurting our sport.

      use public message board forums to slander a coach…and possibly hurt their career and character….

      When someone is guilty of huge malfeasance they and their crime SHOULD be identified. We all know of ppl out ther who get fired from one job, move onto another because their previous employer was afraid of saying something, then the coach goes to a new place, does the same thing – sexual harassment/ embezzlement/ etc – and puts another team through the same shit. That was a train wreck that could have been prevented. Kudos to simon3 for keeping the secret and potentially putting another team through the same problem later.

      I’d personally like to see our sports image improve by cleansing it of the slimeballs.

    • #32540
      Psimon3
      Member

      First and foremost, I only followed the directive of the Athletic Director of Millikin University to not publicly discuss the matter and to direct any questions about this issue to the department or the former head coach (which I did.) As happens a lot on messages board, the truth is often set aside for a more glamorized version of fiction. It is extremely unfortunate that a good coach (and good person) made a mistake but both parties want to move forward. And as for any school that may look to hire Paul in the future, it’s THEIR job to contact the previous employer to find out what happened.

      The only two people, who know EXACTLY happened, are the athletics director and Paul. For anyone to speculate or assume anything about the situation is inappropriate. I consider Paul Kueterman a good friend, a gentleman I have know for quite some, and I am supportive of him and Millikin University trying to rehabilitate their repsective images. That being said I do support Millikin’s decision as it was the right thing to do. On the flip side, If Paul was ever to come to me and asked for a chance to coach at the college level again, I would NOT hesistate to give that 2nd chance. Individuals such as Mike Price, Larry Eustachy, and George O’Leary have mistakes as well and they were allowed an opportunity to change. I do not see any reason why Paul should not be afforded the same opportunity.

      End of Line…

    • #32541
      swimvolt77
      Member

      “Swim, thank you for the advice and the very detailed breakdown of my four lines of text. Maybe I did do a terrible job of conveying my opinion, I’m really not sure? I just don’t think that I was implying the things that you are saying/accusing me of.

      My intent was to keep my comments brief apparently I kept them too brief and allowed them to be taken out of the context that I had intended.

      Mr. Obvious told me not that long ago that I am prone to getting sucked into these boards and yet again that is correct.” -Justin Jennings

      Justin Jennings, that works at DePauw University as an Assistant Coach?
      I think you should be honest now and share that you never talked with the Millikin AD….I’m really sure that the AD at Millikin would want to call an Assistant Coach in Indiana and discuss this situation with them….that makes a whole lot of sense…..be honest. I think that DePauw University would not be happy that you are stating such things about another University and the AD on a message board. Now you have brought yourself into the situation. Word of advice…don’t try to show off by stating lies about who you talked to. It really makes people in high up positions such as an Athletic Director upset when they are being used in lies.

      You wrote something in your signed response that was pretty interesting…

      “Maybe I did do a terrible job of conveying my opinion

      It was your opinion not a factual statement.

      “yeah, ok, but there are people who are hurting our sport. imagine a coach gets fired for sleeping with one of his swimmers. could be this case, could be another, THAT person is hurting our sport.” -aquaholic

      And once again I will ask….what facts and proof do you have to back up those statements concerning this situation.

      “When someone is guilty of huge malfeasance they and their crime SHOULD be identified. We all know of ppl out ther who get fired from one job, move onto another because their previous employer was afraid of saying something, then the coach goes to a new place, does the same thing – sexual harassment/ embezzlement/ etc – and puts another team through the same shit. That was a train wreck that could have been prevented.” -aquaholic

      Have you ever looked yourself in the mirror and wondered if you might be causing the problem by your actions…..using the word CRIME in your last statement is a huge concern here. You have completly not understood any of the posts on this topic. Hope you can take the blinders off. Let me educate you: Slander is pretty easy case in court with the things you are putting in writing, but I think you probably know that since you aren’t putting your name on these statements. Let the 2 people who know the truth answer the questions and make the statements: Millikin AD and former coach. It’s not our place to put the final judgement or cast any judgement…..their might not be anything wrong at all. If the former coach goes for another job or something let him represent himself to that employer and let them check things out if they have concerns and make a decision with their own judgement. It’s that employers choice not ours to decide and it’s the parties involved responsiblity to be truthful and honest in that process.

      Look at how the news is reported everyday….it has to be backed up and checked several times before it can be reported to the public….that’s the ethics of how things work. Get the facts by talking to the sources, ask for permission from those sources to share it and then share it if you feel it is the right thing to do. But be prepared to get yourself involved if you do so or don’t take the right steps. I guess sometimes people just like to dream up the drama to start and share for their own fantasy world or to make themselves feel better.

    • #32542
      aquaholic
      Member

      Good points from Psimon3 and my apologies for directing venom at you. You also make a great point that people can make up for their mistakes. (But scratch George O’Leary in my book, remember he was sued by a former player for intentionaly injuring him, settled out of court of course).

      Then there’s others like the guy who got caught with a video camera in the women’s locker room (it was a D-3 school, F&M or W&J or something), or a certain high-profile coach with a club named after him who now lives in Austrailia to avoid being charged for rape. These are people who repeatedly violated swimmers and people who hurt our sport.

      And for swimvolt – my previous message dealt with hypotheticals. I don’t know the Millikin coach or what he did/didn’t do (maybe you are him).

      If the former coach goes for another job or something let him represent himself to that employer and let them check things out if they have concerns and make a decision with their own judgement.

      That’s the problem. Employers are so scared of getting sued for actually using an opinion that they never come out and say something.

      Something everyone can agree on is the best of luck to the Millikin swimmers. They are a great program. Maybe with Yemm as coach they can get his brother.

    • #32543
      swimvolt77
      Member

      First off, I am not the Millikin coach. Most coaches try and stay away from the message boards from what I see. I am just a person who has been around the sport for a very long time and I think that people are missing the point.

      I understand the extreme cases like you mentioned and those are brought out in public because criminal charges can be filed against them or the university decides to report publicly what went on. In those cases that is public knowledge.

      “That’s the problem. Employers are so scared of getting sued for actually using an opinion that they never come out and say something.”
      -aquaholic

      I do not agree with that statement at all. Private Sector or in Education…employers are going to be honest if asked for a character reference or if they are asked to describe the situation that lead to the employee being terminated or why the person left the position….A company or a college does not want to see someone else suffer with the same things they did….Plus, Universities are usually not that afraid of being sued in these types of cases because of the fact that they know that they have a strong legal team behind them.

      Bottom line, it really just comes down to the coach and they really need to be honest with themselves. Because they are the ones who really have to live with their choices.

      I do wish the best to that university and the swim program there….that has to be a tough situation. I would have to think that recruiting would suffer because of it and the people who suffer the most right now are the swimmers. Hopefully the university can do a national search once the season is over as it looks like they are trying to move on quickly with a quick hire from some grads from last year to just finish out this season from what Psimon3 described earlier in some posts. I guess if they wait until March they would have a huge crop of canidates to work with. It’s always tough, but programs can easily bounce back from something like this as long as they can get the right guy for the job. I think we all agree that we wish the best to that program.

    • #32544
      silentp
      Member

      @swimvolt77 wrote:

      I do not agree with that statement at all. Private Sector or in Education…employers are going to be honest if asked for a character reference or if they are asked to describe the situation that lead to the employee being terminated or why the person left the position….A company or a college does not want to see someone else suffer with the same things they did….Plus, Universities are usually not that afraid of being sued in these types of cases because of the fact that they know that they have a strong legal team behind them.

      Actually, i hate to extend this conversation, but it doesn’t really matter how good the legal team of a University or College is, it is not legeal for any former employer to say anything bad about a former employee. All they can say is whether or not he/she worked there. If they want to say something positive, they may, but nothing negative can be said.

    • #32545
      aquaholic
      Member

      I understand the extreme cases like you mentioned and those are brought out in public because criminal charges can be filed against them

      If they’re public, see if you can name them. Tougher still, see if you can even find anything. Can you guess the TWO college coaches quietly fired for sleeping with swimmers at Massachusetts schools? Maybe the Big 12 coach with multiple DUI’s? Big 10 coach who has filed multiple charges of sexual harassment at every stop on her resume?

      Thanks SilentP – most of the colleges we’re talking about don’t have huge legal teams, typically local lawyers. If their reference about a former employee prevents that employee from future employment, the past employer is at risk of a defamation suit even if the applicant is a low-class slimeball. That’s why something like Psimon’s “If Paul was ever to come to me and asked for a chance to coach at the college level again, I would NOT hesistate to give that 2nd chance. ” is permissible, but a “If Paul was ever to come to me and asked for a chance to coach at the college level again, I would NOT give that 2nd chance.” isn’t.

      Psimon’s comments are enough in my book to warrant a good future for the guy. I don’t know if Millikin will look nationally. Paul was an inside guy. Frank Sampson was local and Brian C????? was a grad student.

    • #32546
      swimvolt77
      Member

      “Actually, i hate to extend this conversation, but it doesn’t really matter how good the legal team of a University or College is, it is not legeal for any former employer to say anything bad about a former employee. All they can say is whether or not he/she worked there. If they want to say something positive, they may, but nothing negative can be said.” -silentP

      Dirty politics can be found everywhere. Universities stand behind their money and in a legal case that takes them pretty far.

      The main problem is rumors and talk. And unfortunately the game of telephone is a bad one. If the right message is there…then yes it works well. But if the story is passed around and is totally untrue, then it is horrible to watch that happen to someone.

      Thats the only reason I started replying to this entire thing was I thought that the coach was getting a bad picture painted on here. People that had no solid proof or facts and who weren’t connected to the whole situation making open ended statements based on nothing. Unless the AD of Millikin or the former coach got on here and posted the truth and answered the questions, I don’t think that any of us have the right to sit here and write untruthful things about a situation like this. I think everyone would agree that if things were being said about their character and career, especially in public that were untrue and by people that had no connection that it would be extremely hard on them and possibly damaging. Hopefully no one who posted on this thread will ever have to be a victim to that.

    • #32547
      Derek
      Member

      I apologize for not being around the past couple of days to end this conversation sooner.

      There is no good reason for this conversation to continue. I have no interest in the career of Paul Kueterman or the mistake he did or did not make. It seems that at first this thread made the assumption that anything could have happened that lead to him leaving, but now the assumption is that he did something wrong. Unless there is a statement from the college or the coach, no assumptions have validity. There are many possible reasons that range from personal family reasons to the more treacherous reasons that have been assumed here. Both “sides” of this argument have really done nothing but further the assumption that Paul Kueterman did something wrong – which, as far as the information on this message board should indicate until those statement appear (from the college or coach), is a falsification.

      This conversation stops now.

    • #32548
      Psimon3
      Member

      Thank you Derek

    • #32549
      The15mMark
      Member

      I agree. I don’t have the power, but maybe the moderators/admins should think about removing this entire discussion from d3swimming.com… That way, nobody gets hurt ’cause there’s no record of this.

    • #32550
      swim5599
      Member

      Yeah this is pretty ridiculous

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