Instant Replay/Cameras

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    • #12672
      silentp
      Member

      After last nights game with the Rockies and Padres, all the sports talk radio this morning centered around the use of instant replay in baseball. I am pro-instant replay in as many situations as possible to get the call right. Could instant replay, or just additional cameras, be used in swimming to get calls correct? I know they have the relay touchpads, but why not just use slow-motion instant replay to see if the person jumped? Seems less pricey and it’s not like the call is instant anyway. There are probably other situations in swimming that could use it, but what are anyone’s thoughts?

    • #38895
      99 Red
      Member

      My gut is that it would be hard to get both swimmers in the same shot. A finish often happens under water, and with lots of splash. You couldn’t use a side view because it would be really hard to see the hand, you couldn’t use an over the top view because the leaving swimmer would always block the lower swimmer, and you couldn’t use an underwater shot because you would miss the top swimmer. You could synchronize 2 cameras, but what advantage does that have over the pad system currently in place?

    • #38896

      I agree with Red. On top of what he said, you’d have to buy very expensive high def slow-motion cameras because when you’re dealing with 1/100th of a second you don’t want the frame to skip over it.
      I think that the pads should be one half of dual confirmation, but shouldn’t be only deciding factor. Last years’ NCAAs had so many false starts that you have to wonder whether or not the pads were working properly.

    • #38897
      Chris Knight
      Member

      I think the pads were probably working pretty well last year, as most of the jumps that it caught were in the medleys. If there had been as many DQs in the frees, then I’d probably think they were over-sensitive. But the odds on the pads somehow being more likely to catch a jump in a medley than a free are low.

    • #38898

      Please correct me if I am wrong, but don’t they use video replay at some of the major Meets (Olympics, World Championships) when a coach protests a call? Example, Aaron Peirsol in 2004 backstroke and I remember a open turn (fly or breast, I don’t remeber) from a meet sometime ago where the anouncers said they reviewed the tape and over turned the call.

    • #38899

      @Its all an ACT wrote:

      Please correct me if I am wrong, but don’t they use video replay at some of the major Meets (Olympics, World Championships) when a coach protests a call? Example, Aaron Peirsol in 2004 backstroke and I remember a open turn (fly or breast, I don’t remeber) from a meet sometime ago where the anouncers said they reviewed the tape and over turned the call.

      the official ruling was that the Judge wrote the DQ in his native language when it states in the rules that all DQ’s must be written in English. TV was just showing us how ridiculous the call was but i dont think the replay had anything to do with it.

    • #38900
      H2allpurpose
      Member

      They could use a side angle for regular starts and it doesn’t take that expensive of a camera to get a good slow motion pic.

      also, why wouldn’t the above shot work…Once the diving swimmer reaches full extension and the only thing you could see was the big toe on the block, you would clearly be able to see if the swimmer had touched, or if you looked as the toe left and you could see if the hand had touched or not….

      the pads suck….

    • #38901
      t3hhammer
      Member

      Where are you supposed to hang the cameras from? Its not like you can have a cameraman standing over a lane. Do you hang them from the ceiling and then zoom in? Even at that angle there is the potential that the swimmer on the blocks will block the finish…making it completely useless.

    • #38902

      I think they should just improve the touch pads until there is practically no margin for error. I can’t remember what the margin is right now but it should be less than one percent for it to be reliable. Statistically, it would still botch a close call every now and then but the likelihood that people would complain about it would be a lot lower.

    • #38903

      There actually ARE cameras hanging over the lanes. This is the automatic back-up for the timing system. FINA mandates complete auto-timing for races, so if the horn-touchpad system doesn’t work, the cameras on light posts over the lanes look down on the lanes to get a photo of the finish. This system actually came into use at least once that I know of: the 1992 Olympic men’s 100m final, Gustavo Borges initially finished out of the medals because his pad malfunctioned. They went to the cameras, and he got his medal.

      Take a look at your Olympic videos: the cameras are on what look like lamp posts overlooking a couplet of lanes. There is one camera post overhanging each couplet of lanes, 1&2, 3&4, etc.

      I do not think these ought to be used for relay take-offs. The technology of the pads will get better. It took touchpads many years to be fail-safe: give RJP’s a chance.

      On a related note, SEC’s was held at UK last year, and they used the Daktronics system, and there was an unusual number of DQ’s caught in one relay. Turned out all of those were thrown out because of a short in the circuit somewhere.

    • #38904

      I just got to thinking about probability:

      If the margin for error is 1 percent, in 100 close relay echanges, there is a 64% chance that one of the starts will be called incorrectly. Basically, in any given meet, by the numbers, it is going to happen.

      If the margin for error is 0.1%, in 100 close relay exchanges there is less than 10% that this will happen.

      0.01% margin – less than one percent chance.

      It’s all in the numbers.

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