2020 PAC Championship

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weedwacker2000
Posts: 232
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:56 pm

2020 PAC Championship

Post by weedwacker2000 » Tue Feb 04, 2020 10:01 am

Wow! After lots of discussion last year on the PAC forum, nothing so far (except this post). Maybe the conference has just run out of quality competition within itself and there's really nothing to discuss. Grove City has the most depth and should win both men and women's championships unless they have a meltdown. Bethany and W&J are pretty much non-competitive, likewise Chatham except for a few. Westminster seems a bit more depleted than in recent years. And I'm not sure where St. Vincent will end up. Anyone else have thoughts to add, or am I way off track?

weedwacker2000
Posts: 232
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:56 pm

Re: 2020 PAC Championship

Post by weedwacker2000 » Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:06 pm

Just having checked the psych sheet it looks like for the first time in the PAC meet both "A and "B" relays are to be scored. Yes/No??

Elroy Jetson
Posts: 97
Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:58 pm

Re: 2020 PAC Championship

Post by Elroy Jetson » Fri Feb 21, 2020 1:23 pm

I honestly thought this site might be down for good when the forums weren't working earlier in the year. I thought all the bots finally took it down. There was so much garbage I stopped checking it.

Anyway, looking at the way things turned out, I have a few thoughts:
1. Congratulations to Dassow, Marzolf, Baum, and May for once again dominating individually. I've looked at the national top times and it appears Marzolf might have a shot at going to NCAAs if she does a last chance meet. She doesn't need to drop much. Holding my breath that Baum finally gets in - I think he'sgot a great shot, but I thought Peffer was in last year too. With almost all of the women's meets over Dassow looks safe. I would be shocked if May didn't get invited. Hopefully a teammate or two will do well enough at regionals to get invited also.
2. scoring A and B relays is a good add. I think it's great that more athletes get to do relays, I always thought that was the most fun part of swimming. The only negatives I see are that an A relay DQ is a lot more devastating, but A & B conceivably means the relays don't impact the final scores much if the A and B order aren't the same.
3. Grove City really dominated, but I'm chalking that up to more of the conference being really down. Winning times were slower across the board and teams are a lot smaller than they used to be. One of the things that stuck out to me was that it looked like Dunlany from Westminster coasted to two victories. He was a lot faster in the past but had absolutely no one to challenge him in the 500 or mile. Hopefully some of these other teams grow and start to push each other. I really think that's why Grove City and Westminster were so fast 5-10 years ago, they both had to step up. I can't remember 8th place times ever being so slow. Some of the women would have finished in the top 8 of men's events, and that's not including Dassow.
4. I almost forgot - Grove City women won without divers?!? This brings up two questions - where did their divers go and how did Westminster's women go from winning the title to losing by so much while taking 135 points in diving? I didn't think they graduated that much last year

I hope this forum is truly fixed and we can start getting a little more conversation generated!

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ThePlowman
Posts: 32
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:15 pm
Team Affiliation: Kalamazoo

Re: 2020 PAC Championship

Post by ThePlowman » Tue Feb 25, 2020 2:41 pm

Nothing to say pertaining to the meet as my home conference is the MIAA but my apologies for the spotty service. We are hard at work trying to keep things in better shape moving forward! Happy to see more activity again on the boards!
"I'd plow that."

PACswimmingnerd
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2016 9:57 pm
Team Affiliation: PAC

Re: 2020 PAC Championship

Post by PACswimmingnerd » Wed Jul 08, 2020 6:35 pm

Glad to see that the forums are back up and operational! TBH I didn't post on this partly because I also believed the site to be down from the bot-pocalypse and wasn't sure if or when it was coming back up, but glad the community is still here! I enjoy reading speculation and analysis from you guys. I didn't comment also partly because...the season just wasn't too interesting this year.

After seeing a couple meet results (really even just after the full rosters were released), I was fairly certain that GCC was gonna run away with both meets. Not to say that there weren't some awesome performances - agreeing with Elroy - WC Diving, Zach Baum, Mallory Marzolf, and Anne Dassow come to mind. It's a shame that COVID happened and canceled the NCAA meet (though it was obviously a necessary precaution). I was looking forward to watching the results! I wonder how the pandemic is going to affect recruiting for the 2021-2022 season as well with campus visits and whatnot.

Scoring A/B relays is a good idea in a conference that is as depleted as ours. Relays are awesome and I'm glad more people can experience them in a championship setting. Nothing more fun than that in my opinion. Though having enough schools that offer swimming & diving to fill up a full final would be preferable... It's awesome that the 800 FR is on Wednesday night finally.

The PAC has become kinda slow overall, especially the depth of the men's race. There's still some top-end talent, but other than Baum and WC Diving, nothing that's making or coming close to NCAAs. Maybe if Luke Mason develops well. The women's meet has (at least for as long as I've been following) been sort of lackluster other than a couple of top-end talents but the fact that some of the girls would have made A final in multiple events for the men's meet is just wild. Four girls could have made the 100 Back A final. We're not talking about crazy standout times either, just under a minute.

I dunno if it's just more difficult to recruit nowadays or what, but all the programs have dipped with every graduation and not been able to reload - at least with top-end talent. W&J, Bethany, and Chatham can't seem to get off the ground. On CollegeSwimming, I'm seeing a large number of quality recruits commit to all sorts of D3 programs. D3 nats invite times are getting faster and faster, the NCAA depth of speed is getting crazy, and it looks like good HS recruits are noticing, committing to good D3 programs. Our conference seems to be going in the opposite direction, at least right now. I'm not sure what needs to be done, but I hope something can be done sooner rather than later. It's a conundrum because fast teams recruit fast swimmers, kids wanna go somewhere that proves they can develop athletes and they're going to get quality training in a competitive environment. Obviously academics, coaching, and team culture play a strong part in decisions as well. Those problems kinda point out why it's no doubt difficult for the other programs to get going.

Look at WC and their three deep freshman classes classes they got back in 2015-2017 and the GCC teams around the Caleb Courage era. A strong conference is good for everyone. Perhaps going back to co-hosting the championship meet with the AMCC would help a bit? They're in a similar situation - both would benefit from the extra competition and a more energetic atmosphere. The Steven Brooks/Dan Simon rivalry wouldn't have been possible without PAC & AMCC racing together. I would have liked to see David Peffer race PSB's Mark Patterson in 2019, he would have been under 1:50 with Peffer in a 200 BK where he otherwise dominated by 5.5 seconds. Patterson had a strong 50.0 100 BK that would have pushed Dane Hoselton and Peffer more as well. Food for thought I guess, though I don't know the logistics of it all.

In terms of next year so far, WC has been releasing their incoming freshman class on its Instagram page. Large girls class, but some research doesn't show any crazy standouts. I'll try to be more active next season :)

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